While this issue can vary from one FI to another, just wanted to get an insight as to how much cash found in a safe deposit box is considered suspicious enough to trigger a SAR filing? I'd definitely opt in to file for anything over $10K but not too sure on any amounts between $5K and $10K.

How is your FI handling this?

On what grounds would you file a SAR? It's not against the law to squirrel away cash in a safe deposit box, even if your bank has a published policy against it. People hoard cash for a number of reasons, a few of which may be illegal, but not all. If there's more to the customer's actions that, taken with the cash cache, make you suspicious of his activity, by all means file. But storing cash in the box isn't enough, IMHO.

Appendix F in the BSA/AML Examination Manual lists a number of transactions involving safe deposit boxes as "red flags," but finding cash in a safe deposit box is not one of them. Agreeing with your observation that opinions will vary, there is no dollar figure at which I would automatically file a SAR on cash found in a safe deposit box.

It would depend on facts and circumstances; e.g. if it was $100K and the renter died of:
* old age at 85, not having been in the box a year or
* a gsw to the chest after a street corner shoot out, having visited the box 4 times a week during the last 3 months

I would make different decisions on the SAR, but my CTRs would be strikingly similar.

BTW...how do you know what your customers keep in their boxes?

You mentioned 10K. 10K or more wouldn't even trigger a CTR unless the customer came out to the teller window and deposited the cash into an account.

You mean if the branch found $50K US currency stored in the safe deposit box (for whatever reason), the bank is not obligated to file a CTR? Where can I see this on the FFIEC examination manual?

It would trigger if it were deposited into the bank. CTR's are triggered for money going over the counter, either way. If the customer walked out with it, it never was deposited or withdrawn from the bank.

How can the bank "find it?" .....back to Richard's question above.......

I do not believe that you will find it anywhere

http://www.ffiec.gov/bsa_aml_infobase/pages_manual/OLM_017.htm

A bank must electronically file a Currency Transaction Report (CTR) for each transaction in currency82 (deposit, withdrawal, exchange, or other payment or transfer) of more than $10,000 by, through, or to the bank.

The exam manual will tell you when a CTR filing must be made. It won't tell you when it isn't required. You simply don't have a currency transaction when you "find" cash in a safe deposit box. Now if there is more to your story, perhaps you'll get a different response.

Assuming the lessee was never present at the scene, if the cash was discovered by the bank staff through a break-in of the box due to rent arrears, or simply opened for the search of a Will, does it still require a CTR? If so, is the bank staff, who brought the cash to the counter, the conductor?

If the cash crosses the counter, it is reportable.

If there is a beneficiary who is with the bank officials when the box is drilled, and the beneficiary picks up the cash and walks out of the bank, it never crossed the counter to be deposited. Therefore, in that case, IMHO, it is not reportable as a CTR. The cash never went into our out of a bank account. (It was never tried to be legitimized.)

Are you conducting a transaction at the counter or simply counting the cash and then placing it in safekeeping? What does your S/D box agreement say about the bank's rights and responsibilities if you have to drill a box? Maybe I put that particular set of Federal Reserve Notes in my box because they have numismatic value. When I discover you put my cash in the drawer and issued an official check or created a deposit account, I'm going to be VERY unhappy.

And the cash is not bank property, so you do not want to park it in a GL account, either.

The only ways the custodian is going to "find" currency in a box is if the box is drilled for nonpayment of rent or the owner died and the bank is involved in the inventory. (In some states it is, in some states it isn't.)

New anon here:
I have worked at my FI for 13 years, after spending another 20 years at other institutions. Tellers here have always been trained that it is illegal to keep cash in your SDB. I have questioned this repeatedly: we don't disclose this anywhere, nor has anyone ever been able to cite a regulation or law that states such. But to this day the teller trainer still teaches them this. It drives me crazy. I have some cash in my own box that is vintage currency. I hope they never find out. SMH.

It's not illegal. Sometimes the contract/lease prohibits it, but that is to help prevent false claims; e.g.

C: "There's $15,000 in cash missing from my box!"

B: "That's very unfortunate. According to paragraph 4 of the contract you signed, you were not supposed to keep cash in your safe deposit box." I'll bet you regret doing it now, don't you?"

Yes......long, long ago....way back in the day......I was a teller and we were told the same thing.....that it's "illegal" to store money in a safe deposit box unless the money was a coin collection or something.

Prohibited by contract is not the same as illegal. But some bankers seem to find it easier to blame policy restrictions on laws or regulation rather than bank policy.

I may have reported possible tax evasion when a cash intensive business was not depositing much cash and actually withdrawing cash before they would visit their safe deposit box.

We have a retired customer that deposited a large check several months ago. The last few weeks he has been making large cash withdrawals (always under $10k and only 1 per week) and then immediately enters his safe deposit box. This "could" be an attempt to hide assets but is it something we should file a SAR on?

For the structuring - you bet. The safe deposit box visits would just be a side note in the narrative.

Suspecting that the customer is placing the cash in a safe deposit box has nothing to do with it IMO. It would be suspect for "structuring," as Randy said, regardless of whether or not you think he's putting it his box or if you see him put it in his pocket.

Red, you mentioned "The last few weeks he has been making large cash withdrawals (always under $10k and only 1 per week) and then. . . ."

Large means different things to different people. Could you please give a range for large withdrawals?

Thanks

They have been $8000 to $9500 each.

He either believes he's clever or your bank is stupid or both. It's structuring. If you saw him put the cash in a brief case, your SAR will say that. If he went to his safe deposit box immediately after each withdrawal, your SAR will say that.

Thanks for the information. I agree with the structuring. (For me a large withdrawal would be $200.)

Yep, I would file for structuring on that, regardless of where the client is taking the money. And even though he is going into the safe deposit booth, you probably aren't seeing him actually placing the cash in there. For all you know he may be taking more cash out of there to go with what he has from your teller.

When Y2K was on the horizon I had several clients who withdrew large amounts of cash. Some took it home, but one woman straight up told me that she was putting it in her safe deposit box. I kept my mouth shut, but my thought process was that if the whole system collapsed on 01/01/00 then the chances of her getting inside the bank to get into that SDB were slim.

If I present audio and video evidence to the manager of a bank in NYC that there is inappropriately confiscated cash and gold coins in a safe deposit box, is the manager obligated to file a report or does he have the right to seal the box or prevent access to the person who rented the box?? I want to prevent the contents from disappearing until the abysmally slow legal system runs its course.

You need to talk to legal counsel. The only avenue to prevent someone access to their own safe deposit box would be through a court order.

I was wondering if any of you have guidance regarding counterfeit funds in a SDB. A customer took funds from their SDB and when tried to deposit, teller found it was counterfeit. It is in foreign currency. The SDB agreement said that the bank has the right to go into the SDB if it knows that there is illegal or dangerous items in the SDB. Well, counterfeiting is illegal. Would the bank have the right to go into the SDB if it has knowledge that the funds being kept there are counterfeit?

I would not without the blessing of your legal counsel. I am not sure why you would want to go in and taint any possible evidence. Leave that up to law enforcement with a search warrant. Notify local law enforcement and file your SAR and let the chips fall where they may.

I concur with Randy on this. Talk to your counsel and unless other advised, in writing, I would not go into the SDB.

I agree that legal counsel needs to be contacted. And you don't know if there is anything illegal in the box at this point, because you don't know if all the funds were removed or not. You can guess, but you don't know. and without legal guidance, i wouldn't be putting our bank at liability.

Was the entire deposit counterfeit? Or just one bill? I have a business owner that makes frequent cash deposits and often a counterfeit will be included. I would hardly consider him counterfeiting or doing anything illegal.

Did your staff talk to the customer? Where did the currency come from? Are they a victim of a scam? Not a smart criminal if they're attempting to deposit counterfeit funds. I think there's more to the story that jumping the gun and busting down the safe deposit vault.

Red Raiders, I would simply ask him why he's withdrawing cash like that? Couch it in terms of being concerned about him being scammed. See what he says.

The customer might be alarmed to be questioned over an incident that happened eight years ago.